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A Subcommittee ofthe Committee on Un-American Activities met at 10 a.m., in room1703 of the Federal Building, Foley Square, New York, New York,the Honorable Francis E. Walter (Chairman) presiding.
Committee memberspresent: Representatives Walter, Edwin E. Willis, and Gordon H.Scherer.
Staff memberspresent: Frank S. Tavenner, Jr., Counsel; Donald T. Appell andFrank Bonora, Investigators; and Thomas W. Beale, Sr., ChiefClerk.
MR. TAVENNER:When and where were you born, Mr. Seeger?
MR. SEEGER: I wasborn in New York in 1919.
MR. TAVENNER:What is your profession or occupation?
MR. SEEGER: Well,I have worked at many things, and my main profession is a studentof American folklore, and I make my living as a banjo picker-sortof damning, in some people's opinion.
MR. TAVENNER HasNew York been your headquarters for a considerable period oftime?
MR. SEEGER: No, Ilived here only rarely until I left school, and after a year ortwo or a few years living here after World War II I got back tothe country, where I always felt more at home.
MR. TAVENNER: Yousay that you were in the Armed Forces of the United States?
MR. SEEGER: Aboutthree and a half years.
MR. TAVENNER:Will you tell us please the period of your service?
MR. SEEGER: Iwent in in July 1942 and I was mustered out in December 1945.
MR. TAVENNER: Didyou attain the rank of an officer?
MR. SEEGER: No.After about a year I made Pfc, and just before I got out I got tobe T-5, which is in the equivilant of a corporal's rating, a longhard pull.
MR. TAVENNER: Mr.Seeger, prior to your entry in the service in 1942, were youengaged in the practice of your profession in the area of NewYork?
MR. SEEGER: It ishard to call it a profession. I kind of drifted into it and Inever intended to be a musician, and I am glad I am one now, andit is a very honorable profession, but when I started outactually I wanted to be a newspaperman, and when I left school --
CHAIRMAN WALTER:Will you answer the question, please?
MR. SEEGER: Ihave to explain that it really wasn't my profession, I picked upa little change in it.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:Did you practice your profession?
MR. SEEGER: Isang for people, yes, before World War II, and I also did asearly as 1925.
MR. TAVENNER: Andupon your return from the service in December of 1945, youcontinued in your profession?
MR. SEEGER: Icontinued singing, and I expect I always will.
MR. TAVENNER: TheCommittee has information obtained in part from the Daily Workerindicating that, over a period of time, especially since Decemberof 1945, you took part in numerous entertainment features. I havebefore me a photostatic copy of the June 20, 1947, issue of theDaily Worker. In a column entitled "What's On" appearsthis advertisement: "Tonight-Bronx, hear Peter Seeger andhis guitar, at Allerton Section housewarming." May I ask youwhether or not the Allerton Section was a section of theCommunist Party?
MR. SEEGER: Sir,I refuse to answer that question whether it was a quote from theNew York Times or the Vegetarian Journal.
MR. TAVENNER: Idon't believe there is any more authoritative document in regardto the Communist Party than its official organ, the Daily Worker.
MR. SCHERER: Hehasn't answered the question, and he merely said he wouldn'tanswer whether the article appeared in the New York Times or someother magazine. I ask you to direct the witness to answer thequestion.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:I direct you to answer.
MR. SEEGER: Sir,the whole line of questioning-
CHAIRMAN WALTER:You have only been asked one question, so far.
MR. SEEGER: I amnot going to answer any questions as to my association, myphilosophical or religious beliefs or my political beliefs, orhow I voted in any election, or any of these private affairs. Ithink these are very improper questions for any American to beasked, especially under such compulsion as this. I would be veryglad to tell you my life if you want to hear of it.
MR. TAVENNER: Hasthe witness declined to answer this specific question?
CHAIRMAN WALTER:He said that he is not going to answer any questions, any namesor things.
MR. SCHERER: Hewas directed to answer the question.
MR. TAVENNER: Ihave before me a photostatic copy of the April 30, 1948, issue ofthe Daily Worker which carries under the same title of"What's On," an advertisement of a "May Day Rally:For Peace, Security and Democracy." The advertisementstates: "Are you in a fighting mood? Then attend the May Dayrally." Expert speakers are stated to be slated for theprogram, and then follows a statement, "Entertainment byPete Seeger." At the bottom appears this: "AuspicesEssex County Communist Party," and at the top,"Tonight, Newark, N.J." Did you lend your talent to theEssex County Communist Party on the occasion indicated by thisarticle from the Daily Worker?
MR. SEEGER: Mr.Walter, I believe I have already answered this question, and thesame answer.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:The same answer. In other words, you mean that you decline toanswer because of the reasons stated before?
MR. SEEGER: Igave my answer, sir.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:What is your answer?
MR. SEEGER: Yousee, sir, I feel-
CHAIRMAN WALTER:What is your answer?
MR. SEEGER: Iwill tell you what my answer is.
(Witnessconsulted with counsel [Paul L. Ross].)
I feel that in mywhole life I have never done anything of any conspiratorialnature and I resent very much and very deeply the implication ofbeing called before this Committee that in some way because myopinions may be different from yours, or yours, Mr. Willis, oryours, Mr. Scherer, that I am any less of an American thananybody else. I love my country very deeply, sir.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:Why don't you make a little contribution toward preserving itsinstitutions?
MR. SEEGER: Ifeel that my whole life is a contribution. That is why I wouldlike to tell you about it.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:I don't want to hear about it.
MR. SCHERER: Ithink that there must be a direction to answer.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:I direct you to answer that question.
MR. SEEGER: Ihave already given you my answer, sir.
MR. SCHERER: Letme understand. You are not relying on the Fifth Amendment, areyou?
MR. SEEGER: No,sir, although I do not want to in any way discredit or depreciateor depredate the witnesses that have used the Fifth Amendment,and I simply feel it is improper for this committee to ask suchquestions.
MR. SCHERER: Andthen in answering the rest of the questions, or in refusing toanswer the rest of the questions, I understand that you are notrelying on the Fifth Amendment as a basis for your refusal toanswer?
MR. SEEGER: No, Iam not, sir.
MR. TAVENNER: Ihave before me a photostatic copy of May 4,1949, issue of theDaily Worker, which has an article entitled, "May Day SmashReview Put on by Communist Cultural Division, On Stage," andthe article was written by Bob Reed. This article emphasizes aproduction called Now Is the Time, and it says this: Now Is theTime was a hard-hitting May Day show of songs and knife-edgedsatire. New songs and film strips walloped the enemies of thepeople in what the singers called "Aesopian language."And other persons [participated], including Pete Seeger. Lee Haysis recited to be the MC, or master of ceremonies. Did you takepart in this May Day program under the auspices of the MusicSection of the Cultural Division of the Communist Party?
MR. SEEGER: Mr. Chairman, the answer is the same as before.
MR. SCHERER: Ithink we have to have a direction.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:I direct you to answer the question.
MR. SEEGER: Ihave given you my answer, sir.
MR. TAVENNER: Thearticle contains another paragraph, as follows: This performanceof Now Is the Time was given in honor of the twelve indictedCommunist Party leaders. And then it continues with Bob Reed'saccount of the show: This reviewer has never seen a show whichstirred its audience more. Add up new material, fine personal andgroup performances, overwhelming audience response-the result wasa significant advance in the people's cultural movement. Now Isthe Time is that rare phenomenon, a political show in whichperformers and audience had a lot of fun. It should be repeatedfor large audiences. Mr. Lee Hays was asked, while he was on thewitness stand, whether or not he wrote that play, and he refusedto answer. Do you know whether he was the originator of thescript?
MR. SEEGER: Do Iknow whether he was the originator of the script? Again my answeris the same. However, if you want to question me about any songs,I would be glad to tell you, sir.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:That is what you are being asked about now.
MR. TAVENNER: Yousaid that you would tell us about the songs. Did you participatein a program at Wingdale Lodge in the State of New York, which isa summer camp for adults and children, on the weekend of JulyFourth of this year?
(Witnessconsulted with counsel.)
MR. SEEGER:Again, I say I will be glad to tell what songs I have ever sung,because singing is my business.
MR. TAVENNER: Iam going to ask you.
MR. SEEGER: But Idecline to say who has ever listened to them, who has writtenthem, or other people who have sung them.
MR. TAVENNER: Didyou sing this song, to which we have referred, "Now Is theTime," at Wingdale Lodge on the weekend of July Fourth?
MR. SEEGER: Idon't know any song by that name, and I know a song with asimilar name. It is called "Wasn't That a Time." Isthat the song?
CHAIRMAN WALTER:Did you sing that song?
MR. SEEGER: I cansing it. I don't know how well I can do it without my banjo.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:I said, Did you sing it on that occasion?
MR. SEEGER: Ihave sung that song. I am not going to go into where I have sungit. I have sung it many places.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:Did you sing it on this particular occasion? That is what you arebeing asked.
MR. SEEGER: Againmy answer is the same.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:You said that you would tell us about it.
MR. SEEGER: Iwill tell you about the songs, but I am not going to tell you ortry to explain-
CHAIRMAN WALTER:I direct you to answer the question. Did you sing this particularsong on the Fourth of July at Wingdale Lodge in New York?
MR. SEEGER: Ihave already given you my answer to that question, and allquestions such as that. I feel that is improper: to ask about myassociations and opinions. I have said that I would bevoluntarily glad to tell you any song, or what I have done in mylife.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:I think it is my duty to inform you that we don't accept thisanswer and the others, and I give you an opportunity now toanswer these questions, particularly the last one.
MR. SEEGER: Sir,my answer is always the same.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:All right, go ahead, Mr. Tavenner.
MR. TAVENNER:Were you chosen by Mr. Elliott Sullivan to take part in theprogram on the weekend of July Fourth at Wingdale Lodge?
MR. SEEGER: Theanswer is the same, sir.
MR. WILLIS: Wasthat the occasion of the satire on the Constitution and the Billof Rights?
MR. TAVENNER: Thesame occasion, yes, sir. I have before me a photostatic copy of apage from the June 1, 1949, issue of the Daily Worker, and in acolumn entitled "Town Talk" there is found thisstatement: The first performance of a new song, "If I Had aHammer," on the theme of the Foley Square trial of theCommunist leaders, will he given at a testimonial dinner for the12 on Friday night at St. Nicholas Arena. . . .Among those onhand for the singing will be . . . Pete Seeger, and Lee Hays-andothers whose names are mentioned. Did you take part in thatperformance?
MR. SEEGER: Ishall he glad to answer about the song, sir, and I am notinterested in carrying on the line of questioning about where Ihave sung any songs.
MR. TAVENNER: Iask a direction.
CHAIRMAN WALTER:You may not he interested, but we are, however. I direct you toanswer. You can answer that question.
MR. SEEGER: Ifeel these questions are improper, sir, and I feel they areimmoral to ask any American this kind of question.
MR. TAVENNER:Have you finished your answer?
MR. SEEGER: Yes,sir.
MR. TAVENNER: Idesire to offer the document in evidence and ask that it bemarked "Seeger exhibit No.4," for identification only,and to be made a part of the Committee files.
MR. SEEGER: I amsorry you are not interested in the song. It is a good song.
MR. TAVENNER:Were you present in the hearing room while the former witnessestestified?
MR. SEEGER: Ihave been here all morning, yes, sir.
MR. TAVENNER: Iassume then that you heard me read the testimony of Mr. [Elia]Kazan about the purpose of the Communist Party in having itsactors entertain for the henefit of Communist fronts and theCommunist Party. Did you hear that testimony?
MR. SEEGER: Yes,I have heard all of the testimony today.
MR. TAVENNER: Didyou hear Mr. George Hall's testimony yesterday in which he statedthat, as an actor, the special contribution that he was expectedto make to the Communist Party was to use his talents by entertainingat Communist Party functions? Did you hear that testimony?
MR. SEEGER: Ididn't hear it, no.
MR. TAVENNER: Itis a fact that he so testified. I want to know whether or not youwere engaged in a similar type of service to the Communist Partyin entertaining at these features.
(Witnessconsulted with counsel.)
MR. SEEGER: Ihave sung for Americans of every political persuasion, and I amproud that I never refuse to sing to an audience, no matter whatreligion or color of their skin, or situation in life. I havesung in hobo jungles, and I have sung for the Rockefellers, and Iam proud that I have never refused to sing for anybody. That isthe only answer I can give along that line.
